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PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 1:40 am 
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2nd Banana
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Joined: Wed Dec 28, 2005 1:16 pm
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Location: San Diego, CA.
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COuldn't tell you. All I know is brad brooks is the man. I swear he was right near 140mph traps. But, they did window the motor first trip to the track, then tony parted it out. But remember, that header design made a HUGE difference in that car versus others. One way to tell is to listen to the exhuast. Sounds nothing like most dsms. Much more open and throaty/raspy. And that Tial housing all made it efficient. Just like you said above, boost is irrelevant. The torque is low because of the design on the car. It is a top end monster and was setup to be that way.

I can't wait to have videos for you guys on jason's car. Hopefully tomorrow I can work on the tune some more and get some more boost in it.
Yeah, the low boost thing just freaked me out because I would figure you'd have to run that thing right in its efficiency range to make that kinda power, and 23psi is pretty low for a 35R. The V-band housing is pretty much pure sex, that's about as bad-ass as 35R's get right there, especially for not being an HTA. It sounds like a motor that's making a lot of horsepower, that's all.

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91 GSX - 511fwhp and 352 lb/ft 25psi 110 octane, 7.68 @ 95.9mph 1/8th 21psi 91 octane, 11.93 @ 112.9mph, 117.7mph best trap speed, 20psi 91 octane
98 Volvo S70 T5 - DD

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 1:52 am 
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Some call me a god

Joined: Thu May 05, 2005 2:31 am
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Location: Commerce City, Co
He was also running key igniton components that less than 10 dsms run. That in itself is a key component. It is not like his car is curt brown status, but what you expect a well built dsm to have. That and a real PROFESSIONAL tuner.

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1985 Mitsubishi Cordia
Build in progress


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 2:56 am 
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CSM Junkie

Joined: Sun Mar 08, 2009 8:33 pm
Posts: 544
Location: Ulster County NY
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I'm not trying to talk shit or anything. I've actually met Tony Turk before and seen his car in person. I wonder what his best trap in the 1/4 is. If you work really hard on tuning for a peak number you can probably get that number pretty easily. That's really low boost to be making that kind of power too, but the torque is so low, that's just crazy to me, I can't wrap my head around it. I also can't believe how lean they're running it. I wonder how much timing they've got in that thing?


I'm going to take a guess and say the tq was low because the head manifold design. And it could be running lean for that matter. Or it's out of fuel.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 3:02 am 
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Some call me a god
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Location: Cincinnati
HP is a calculation based the actual torque generated by an engine and the speed at which the engine is generating that torque. If measured torque is low but HP is high it is usually because someone is spinning the shit out of an engine.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 3:22 am 
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Some call me a god
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Location: Cincinnati
Here are some specs on that BG S475: Inducer 74.5mm Exducer 100mm Flow 98lb/min yada yada yada Recommended for 400-460CID gas engines making 800-1,000whp. LMAO

Oh and apparently it eats cats too...
Image
Here's the link to some other pics... http://wistreetscene.com/forum/viewtopi ... =54&t=3950


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 3:46 am 
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Spends Too Much Time Under The Hood

Joined: Mon Aug 19, 2002 1:02 am
Posts: 237
Location: georgia
i like to put my compression test on his motor and see what it reads.

a few months ago, i got my motor to make 567hp at 21psi with 18 degree of timing before my oil pump took a crap on the dyno and i had to quit. i was only 33hp away from making 600hp on what people consider to be low boost. another pound or two of boost and 15-16 degree of timing would have gotten me there. you saw from the dyno sheet that i posted that the motor can make 550hp with 22.5psi and 13.5 degree of timing. that is with me not reving to 8500rpm. i am on a non hta gt35r with old school crower stage 3 cams. old school crower stage 3 cams are consider to be like hks272in/272ex but they are less efficient according to a test done years ago. i am running 11:1 wiseco pistons. i am on e85 so i can be retarded like that. my matco compression tester reads 235psi when i compression test my engine is cold. that is 75psi higher than 1g pistons and 55psi higher than 2g pistons. most engines that i compression tested with over the counter 8.3-8.5:1 je, wiseco, or ross pistons yield between 160-170psi if they have high duration cams. these engines with the lower compression reading generally make about 100hp-150 lower than mine at the same boost level even when they have turbos that are slightly larger.

the guy with the eclipse is running 9:1 ross pistons. we don't know how thick his head gasket is. we don't know if he has flat face valves or dish face valves. we don't know if he has welded combustion chambers or not. thin head gasket combine with flat face valves and 9:1 piston can easily kick his engine up to 10-10.5:1 compression ratio. if the head and block are decks to achieve .035 to .040 quench distance, i can see the compression increasing too. with welded combustion chamber, he can kick it up to 11:1 compression with no problem. combine the higher compression with a bad ass head and a efficient turbo setup, i believe he can make the power he is claiming on that boost level. however, the 600hp pump gas deal is very questionable. many guys claimed their cars have pump gas tunes when they sprayed a ton of methanol into their engines. i like to know if he is running methanol or not.

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615hp and 475tq at 23psi and 75shots
http://gadsm.org/showthread.php?t=37685


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 4:43 pm 
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Some call me a god

Joined: Thu May 05, 2005 2:31 am
Posts: 1789
Location: Commerce City, Co
Breaking up issues corrected. Going to try to see if we can get some rpm and boost out of it tomorrow. Also put a bigger spring in wastegate.

_________________
1985 Mitsubishi Cordia
Build in progress


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 5:25 pm 
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CSM Junkie

Joined: Sun Mar 08, 2009 8:33 pm
Posts: 544
Location: Ulster County NY
Quote:
i like to put my compression test on his motor and see what it reads.

a few months ago, i got my motor to make 567hp at 21psi with 18 degree of timing before my oil pump took a crap on the dyno and i had to quit. i was only 33hp away from making 600hp on what people consider to be low boost. another pound or two of boost and 15-16 degree of timing would have gotten me there. you saw from the dyno sheet that i posted that the motor can make 550hp with 22.5psi and 13.5 degree of timing. that is with me not reving to 8500rpm. i am on a non hta gt35r with old school crower stage 3 cams. old school crower stage 3 cams are consider to be like hks272in/272ex but they are less efficient according to a test done years ago. i am running 11:1 wiseco pistons. i am on e85 so i can be retarded like that. my matco compression tester reads 235psi when i compression test my engine is cold. that is 75psi higher than 1g pistons and 55psi higher than 2g pistons. most engines that i compression tested with over the counter 8.3-8.5:1 je, wiseco, or ross pistons yield between 160-170psi if they have high duration cams. these engines with the lower compression reading generally make about 100hp-150 lower than mine at the same boost level even when they have turbos that are slightly larger.

the guy with the eclipse is running 9:1 ross pistons. we don't know how thick his head gasket is. we don't know if he has flat face valves or dish face valves. we don't know if he has welded combustion chambers or not. thin head gasket combine with flat face valves and 9:1 piston can easily kick his engine up to 10-10.5:1 compression ratio. if the head and block are decks to achieve .035 to .040 quench distance, i can see the compression increasing too. with welded combustion chamber, he can kick it up to 11:1 compression with no problem. combine the higher compression with a bad ass head and a efficient turbo setup, i believe he can make the power he is claiming on that boost level. however, the 600hp pump gas deal is very questionable. many guys claimed their cars have pump gas tunes when they sprayed a ton of methanol into their engines. i like to know if he is running methanol or not.


Exactly what he said you never know what someone truly has done with there build unless you yourself built the engine.

Even spinning the engine to high rpm's the dyno will still read it's max TQ the only thing it will effect if the head doesn't flow as well up in those rpm's the tq will dive off.

But usually with high compression the power will hit a lot sooner and the tq would be higher. Unless he had to lower the timing on the pump tune with higher compression I would assume was the deal.

The goal to have a good set up is to keep the TQ flat along with the HP then you have a great all around engine and have hit your sweat spot. Look's like they got there.


This car is FWD I suppose it could have been spinning tire. There is one small dip in the dyno sheet where that could be the case. Does he happen to have a dyno based on RPM's? Or was the tach pickup not working on this dynojet also?


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 7:05 pm 
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Spends Too Much Time Under The Hood
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Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2007 5:44 pm
Posts: 306
Location: Cleveland / D.C.
Quote:
I wonder what his best trap in the 1/4 is
His best trap was 141... 97 in the 1/8th haha


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 7:38 pm 
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CSM Junkie

Joined: Sun Mar 08, 2009 8:33 pm
Posts: 544
Location: Ulster County NY
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Quote:
I wonder what his best trap in the 1/4 is
His best trap was 141... 97 in the 1/8th haha

Thats a big jump :) if it was AWD probably would have went 9's wonder if he was on slicks or not?

Look's like he's parting out his car I think this is his..

http://www.dsmtuners.com/classifieds/4g ... hid=115369


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 7:58 pm 
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Spends Too Much Time Under The Hood
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Joined: Sun Jun 03, 2007 5:44 pm
Posts: 306
Location: Cleveland / D.C.
No, he parted his car out a couple years ago


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2010 8:06 pm 
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CSM Junkie

Joined: Sun Mar 08, 2009 8:33 pm
Posts: 544
Location: Ulster County NY
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No, he parted his car out a couple years ago


Oh just seen there in different locations.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 10:26 am 
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Some call me a god
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Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2006 12:08 pm
Posts: 1025
Location: Las Vegas, NV
The reason the tq is low is because the boost is low. A motor with low compression and only 2 liters needs boost to make Tq. I could see this GT45 making 700hp and 200 ft lbs at 25-28 psi.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 6:36 pm 
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Some call me a god

Joined: Thu May 05, 2005 2:31 am
Posts: 1789
Location: Commerce City, Co
To those who were behind us, we thank you for that.

For the doubters, you guys were mostly right.

I messed with it for a while today and had good and bad results. The turbo will spool. But I am not sure if we are willing to rev the motor in hopes of reaching that threshold I would like to to see. At this point it never stops building boost. Certainly no flat line. And at 8750rpm it sure sounds like hell is about to end, but I am not sure if taking the motor to 10,000 is what we set out to do. It will spool, it is just a matter of how much risk and sacrifice we are willing to make.

With that said, it makes 6-8psi at 7500rpm, 10-12psi at 8000rpm and 17psi at 8750. I starts to move very well way up there, but there is so much to consider trying to play at those rpms. We gave it our best shot. We really tried. But if there was a way to get this thing into a T4 housing, or if we had the smaller S475(which would have the T4 housing), I think I would not be writing this email. But in the end, we walk away humbled, yet proud and smarter. We proved to ourselves we could make it work and it would go fast. It probably would run 115mph the way is sits, with a crappy ET of course.

But for $650 into the turbo, exhaust and elbow, we did not really lose out. When we sell the turbo we will likely break even on it. So not too much lost there. May not be able to sell the exhaust or use it, but I may look into a local diesel shop and see if they can use any of the metal.

We certainly learned a lot about these motors, expanded our design ideas and learned a new respect for what it takes to play in a mans world.

With that said, the turbo is coming off and we will work towards a 66-67mm T4 setup.

_________________
1985 Mitsubishi Cordia
Build in progress


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 03, 2010 6:49 pm 
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Some call me a god
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Location: Las Vegas, NV
Nobody was hating, we all just knew it wouldnt work. Build an 11.5:1 2.0 and add some nitrous that will kick on under 30 psi and it will work.


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